Exactly how insanely blinded are some Calvinists?
Apparently very blinded and self-induced at that.
This was a conversation I had recently with someone who was defending Calvinism and more specifically John Calvin and his role in the murder of Servetus.
This person actually admitted that they did not have to read anything by John Calvin to know what they know about John Calvin. They said this after I provided quotes from Calvin which incriminates himself in the matter.
Often Calvinists are just this willfully ignorant and refuse to approach the facts without their Calvinistic blinders on.
It appears the person gave up and ended up blocking me. I tried to use reason but that was not acceptable to this individual.
It makes sense that the followers of a man so blinded to the truth would be as well.
Here is how the conversation unfolded. It was an amazing but really sad thing to behold.
I did what I could to protect the identity of the poor soul in order to not add on to them any further embarrassment.
Hopefully and prayerfully they will seek the truth and repent.
Calvinist to me: so you think calvin murdered Servetus ? where are the Facts ?
Me to the Calvinist: Servetus was murdered on 10/271553.
Calvin wrote the following after the murder in early 1554 in defense of his role in the murder:
“Whoever shall now contend that it is unjust to put heretics and blasphemers to death will knowingly and willingly incur their very guilt. This is not laid down on human authority; it is God who speaks and prescribes a perpetual rule for his Church. It is not in vain that he banishes all those human affections which soften our hearts; that he commands paternal love and all the benevolent feelings between brothers, relations, and friends to cease; in a word, that he almost deprives men of their nature in order that nothing may hinder their holy zeal. Why is so implacable a severity exacted but that we may know that God is defrauded of his honour, unless the piety that is due to him be preferred to all human duties, and that when his glory is to be asserted, humanity must be almost obliterated from our memories? Many people have accused me of such ferocious cruelty that I would like to kill again the man I have destroyed. Not only am I indifferent to their comments, but I rejoice in the fact that they spit in my face.”
Prior to the murder he wrote things which demonstrated that he premeditated his direct role in the intentional murder of Servetus.
To claim that God justified this murder is justified by the Old Testament and more pointedly the Mosaic Law as John Calvin tried to do is blatantly in error and goes against what Jesus said for us today.
Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:  But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.  Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee;  Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.  Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison.  Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing. Matthew 5:21-26
God would rather none to perish but for all to come to repentance. If Servetus was a heretic then to murder him leaves no future room for him to repent. No amount of claims regarding unconditional election can justify this murder because if you do not allow the time in one’s life to carry on you never know if they will repent or not. This goes against God’s desires for us and how we should treat our enemies but more importantly how we treat His enemies in the times we live in today.
Here are some of Calvin’s quotes that demonstrate it was premeditated murder on his part:
“God makes plain that the false prophet is to be stoned without mercy. We are to crush beneath our heel all affections of nature when his honor is involved” 1951
“[They] well deserve to be repressed by the sword which is committed to you, seeing that they attack not the King only, but God who has seated him upon the throne, and has entrusted to you the protection as well of His person as of His majesty.” 1548
“But when I perceived that the fury of certain bad men had risen to such a height in your realm, that there was no place in it for sound doctrine, I thought it might be of service if I were in the same work both to give instruction to my countrymen, and also lay before your Majesty a Confession, from which you may learn what the doctrine is that so inflames the rage of those madmen who are this day, with fire and sword, troubling your kingdom. For I fear not to declare, that what I have here given may be regarded as a summary of the very doctrine which, they vociferate, ought to be punished with confiscation, exile, imprisonment, and flames, as well as exterminated by land and sea. This, I allow, is a fearful punishment which God sends on the earth; but if the wickedness of men so deserves, why do we strive to oppose the just vengeance of God?” 1536.
I have yet to see a quote from Calvin where he confessed and repented of his role in Servetus’ murder.
Why am I constantly bringing this up? To try to wake up any of Calvin’s followers today who will listen to reason. I hope to help show them where their doctrines originated from, a very hate filled murderous man who justifies everything on God’s decrees instead of actually taking ownership of his own heinous sins as well as repenting of them.
It does matter that a man who is essentially venerated as a Church Father died an unrepentant murderer and it does matter whether anyone chooses to follow after the teachings of such a man.
Calvinist to me: thats not convincing sir and i need a source
Me to the Calvinist: uh, the source was John Calvin. I compiled his quotes with scriptures. Amazing that the man's own words will not convince you. Ditch your blinding presuppositions for a while and search for the truth yourself. I used to consider the man a church father but he is nothing but a heretical unrepentant murderer. I had to repent of my past foolish thinking and pray that you do the same.
Calvinist to me: nice assertions but John boy didn’t murder anyone and besides that i don’t read John Calvin
Me to the Calvinist: You can start with his own bogus defense of the murder. He abuses scripture in doing so. Look up his Defense of the orthodox faith in the sacred Trinity (Defensio orthodoxae fidei de sacra Trinitate)
Calvinist to me: read up and learn something 👇
Me to the Calvinist: I recommend reading this:
Calvinist to me: yet you slander an innocent man
Me to the Calvinist: He that answereth a matter before he heareth it, it is folly and shame unto him. Proverbs 18:13
Calvinist to me: great an anti calvinist site
Calvinist to me: Calvin was telling servetus to recant
Me to the Calvinist: you are blinded
Calvinist to me: nope your ignorant
Calvinist to me: i’m not reading anything that is anticalvnistic
Calvinist to me: i once hated calvinism because you guys spew such phoney trash and mislead to follow in your filth of man centered free willism
Me to the Calvinist: Calvin influenced the formation of the murderous laws. I gave you his very words that indict him. You need to repent of your willful ignorance and for defending a murderer
Calvinist to me: load of bull look at other sources
Calvinist to me: not just that link
Me to the Calvinist: I imagine that you think he was justified because the killing was according to the laws of the land (Geneva)
Calvinist to me: news flash the laws were different back then and they murder heretics and John didn’t murdered him .
Me to the Calvinist: Being filled with all unrighteousness ... wickedness ... murder ... Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them. Romans 1:29,32
Calvinist to me: better look at other sources then following Finny sources
Me to the Calvinist: you are hopeless. I read a lot more than that. I began my walk almost purely in Calvinist writings and teachings. I started to read more but it was God's word that really woke me up.
Me to the Calvinist: you said "John Hicks nice assertions but John boy didn’t murder anyone and besides that i don’t read John Calvin". So you are defending the man but you do not read his own words? That is sad. I need to move on. I tried.
Calvinist to me: reading about his history is all i need to know . i don’t really care about what you did or what trash site you looked at , but i’ve been there that i once (( hated ))Calvinism because i didn’t understand it an i too thought Calvin was a murder because of fallacies dogma like you are spewing now and i do say please better look at other sources and read the scriptures and i don’t read John Calvin theology cause i don’t need too , all i need is the word of God and other theologians for knowledge 😎
so i move on and i hope you do find the other sources about John Calvin and learn the truth about Calvinism .. ✌️
Me to the Calvinist: you are sadly contradicting yourself and cannot even see it. Can you even understand what you are saying? You are defending Calvinism but at the same time saying you "don't read John Calvin theology cause I don't need to". If John Calvin, himself, cannot satisfy you as a legitimate source on John Calvin then you are being willfully ignorant and are hopelessly blinded by your own choice...Also, regarding the link you provided, http://www.sounddoctrine.net/.../false_views_on_John..., that writer arbitrarily reaches a false conclusion by leaving out important historical facts about John Calvin's role. Calvin influenced the laws of Geneva to put heretics to death and he was directly responsible for the capture of Servetus knowing full well the outcome. Yeah, he tried to swing Servetus over to his false theology but that is in no way an attempt at winning "Servetus to Christ" as the writer falsely asserts. Paul, Jude, and most importantly, Jesus Christ, have all commanded us to win folks to Christ and to pull them from the flames, not throw them into the flames. Please listen to reason and repent and turn to the truth. One last question and I am signing off. If the U.S.A. or whatever country you or anyone lives in, makes it legal to kill heretics, is it ok then to kill someone for heresy?